August Jacob's Hot Springs.

[Tim_Messing]

For a number of years now I've heard rumors of August Jacob's Hot Springs. By word of mouth I know that this one actually exists and is soakable. Other rumers I've heard from fellow soakers at Skookumchuck Hot Springs is in Frank Creek itself, at the base of a cascade or waterfall (i.e inaccessable during high water\spring snow melt ect.)

This is an excerpt from "Hot Springs of Western Cannada" by Glenn Woodsworth, Chapter 1: The Lower Mainland of British Columbia. page 69

This springwas mentioned in geographical reports in the 1920s but was then lost for many years. It was found again during airborne infra-red prospecting for geothermal sources in the 1970s but was not visited at that time. It has been rediscovered by hikers, but I don't have detailed information.

The spring is probably located at about 600 m (2000ft) elevation on Frank Creek south of Ska'tin (Skookumchuck) village. Water temperature reaches about 51.5°C (125°F). Take map 92G/16 and be prepared for steep, brushy travel.

map of the area from the guide book mentioned above.

In August 2003 I made an effort to look for this hot springs but didn't turn anything up. I did dicovered that Mr. Woodsworth was right and that the Frank Creek drainage is indeed overflowing with steep\brush travel. When I get some more time I'll post some scans of topographical maps of the area.



Falls on Frank Creek. Think this was the point where I said that was enough, turned around and headed back to the truck.

Thats is all I have to work with. If others have been out looking for this hot springs I'd be interested hear what you found or if you've other rumors to add to the pile.

Thanks .

Tim.M

[soaksdata]

I have photos of our hike up Frank Creek to a slot waterfall, I would have to do some serious digging to find the way points(aprox. a mile up).
It was all waterfalls/cascades and slow going, but no hot water in the creek...we were in it the entire way.
We did not check Frank Creek from the road down, only the road up...up creek.
There is a home at the bottom, so it may be there.
There are some other locations to search.....go at low water for sure.
We did a Glacier Lake search, and a few others so if you want more detail email me.
There never seems to be enough time when in that area ,and one of my personal favorites at the top of my destination list.
It would be easy to spend the entire summer exploring and not see half of it, and the bears are everywhere.
Secure all your stuff well. People stole anything they could from our camp.It was cleaned out in a matter of an 2 hours.
It was well out of the way and secluded at a dead end, still they got us. They even took a wet Ocean city beach towel and string for a cloths line.
Be aware.

[Kim_S]

Tom, (Bulldozer) and/or Mike Sato, have you explored in this area?

[soaksdata]

The next areas I want to explore; The Sloquet River basin, Fire Creek, and Snow Cap Creek .
If you go to Glacier lake take a kayak/canoe, there is a nice camp spot at the base of the lake. You could explore the drainage from both directions there.
The road ends high above the lake and there is a marked ski trail that starts there, but we did not see a trail in the summer.
I have kayaked the Stein, Nahatlatch River, Silver Creek,Cogburn Creek, Statlu Creek,and the Chehalis River.
This entire area is so incredibly wild and beautiful because access is tough and limited even by foot or kayak .
It is #1 for me when you want to get away from people and into a vast wilderness with hot springs.

[Bulldozer]

Yeah I don't have much more to add here either. Those in the know are very secretive, it is still basically untouched at this point, no established pools from my source, etc... Very few have actually found it. I've had the same time issues, did some half hearted bushwhacking, scrapped knees, soaking wet shoes, climb up 5 feet slide back down 3 feet, got beat back by the bugs.
There is many rumours of other hotsprings in the area also. I was once offered a guided trip to a sacred(First Nations)hotsprings for $50, but I didn't like the terms, (blindfold). Claimed it was down by/above Port Douglas, opposite side of the valley to Sloquet H/s. Another rumour of a hotspring on the McGillvary Pass, between Darcy and Gold Bridge(Hunters). Yet another is said to be above Boston Bar in the Fraser Canyon/Nahatlatch area(a since moved local). These are rumoured, the tellers adamant of the existance, but until I see it myself or hear from a more credible source or even multiple sources.

[Kim_S]

Thanks Tom! Wow- blindfolded- those terms are just a little too strange! In some ways, it's nice to know there may still be some "undiscovered" hot springs out there...

[Tim_Messing]

Thanks for the input Bulldozer and Soakdata.

Heres that topographical map of the Frank Creek area. There really isn't any terran that screams out hot springs.



Keep the comments coming.

Thanks.

-- Tim.M

[Kim_S]

Tim-thanks! What's your source for the topo? Is it scanned in, or do you have an online source?

[soaksdata]

The map looks like Fugawi...otherwise known as where the FU*K are we.
The maps software was scanned off very old maps, so they are not as useful as you would think.
A better map/software for roads would be Backroad Mapbook(http://www.backroadmapbooks.com), volume 1 covers Southwestern BC.
I use both since Fugawi is ok for topo and Backroad is ok for roads.

If you want to search Frank Creek I would start above , we found a road that ends above 600 meters and 1 creek north.
Many of the roads are not listed on maps because of ongoing logging, this road is not listed but is the 1st road north of Frank Creek if I remember right.
The terrain is VERY vertical and the creeks are hard core bushwhacks with falls, climbing gear would be helpful along with trail tape.

There is a soak that the locals go to when Skookumchuck is full and from what I have been told within 30 minutes of Skookumchuck HS.
The areas I listed are within that range.
I believe there are several in the area but the terrain and access will keep them unknown.

[Mike_Sato]

You won’t be able to find August Jacob's and Glacier Lake hot springs by following rumors by fellow soakers using Skookumchuck, or local First Nation members. This is because in Jan 26, 2007, the In-Shuck ch First Nation had asked me to research the August Jacob's Hot Springs and Glacier Creek Hot Springs which are in their traditional territory. In-Shuck-ch First Nation needed the water licenses for these hot springs, as part of the British Columbia Treaty Process. In order to give them the water license, the Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development (“DIAND”) to required from them accurate information on the location (coordinate and elevation), water flow, and water temperature. Of all the 980 local First Nation members, there was no one who had any information regarding this, and that is why I was appointed this task. The Skookumchuck and Sloquet are already part of the Treaty Settlement land.

The August Jacob's Hot Springs is very difficult to find. This spring area was mentioned in geological reports from 1927 but was then lost for many years. In 1996, after several attempts my friend was able to re-discover these hot springs. Hearing this from him, I headed for this hot spring with another friend. It was very difficult to find due to that fact that the previously reported locations in documents and books were wrong. The Topo Maps 1/50000 posted by Tim was the wrong area and the hot springs cannot be found in that section. Even Glenn Woodsworth Hot Springs of Western Canada 2nd edition won’t be of use when looking for this hot spring. In this book, it states “It has been rediscovered by hikers, but I don't have detailed information”, this is in reference to us. This is because the person who first re-discovered it did not want to make it known to the public; I respected his effort, but convinced him to provide information for this book. The Water temperature of 51.5°C (125°F) listed in this book is the only information that was provided. Most recently, I have also passed over this hot spring site in a helicopter Jan 26, 2007. With my directions, a friend of mine was able to reach this spring in May 2008 as well.

Regarding the Glacier Lake Hot Springs, I researched during the same helicopter flight mentioned previously. I was with accompanied by a few geologists, but we were unable to find it. I had attempted to find this hot springs twice before, but was still unable to find it. Later, my friend discovered an 1897 Harrison & Fire Lake’s old mining map. According to this, the real name is Daly’s Hot Springs. This map is extremely accurate even by today’s standards. If I attempt to find this hot spring one more time, using this map, I am certain I would be able to find it as long as it still exists.

For anyone else, trying to find either of these 2 hot springs with any currently available information would be very difficult, as none of them appears to be accurate. If Glenn Woodsworth releases his “Hot Springs of Western Canada 3nd edition” in the future, then it will likely contain the most reliable and accurate information regarding these 2 hot springs.

Mike Sato

[Tim_Messing]

Thanks for posting your insight\information regarding August Jacob's Hot Springs Mike. British Columbia is outside of my normal territory so my information is all gleemed from books like Hot Springs of Western Canada.

In 1996, after several attempts my friend was able to re-discover these hot springs. Hearing this from him, I headed for this hot spring with another friend. It was very difficult to find due to that fact that the previously reported locations in documents and books were wrong.

Mike, since you have been "On Site" at August Jacob's do you have any pictures that you could post of the hot springs itself that wouldn't give away its location? I'd like to get an idea of what sort of spring this is appearance wise.

Even Glenn Woodsworth Hot Springs of Western Canada 2nd edition won’t be of use when looking for this hot spring.

I didn't really expect Glenn Woodsworth's directions to be all that accurate but to find out that it isn't even in the Frank Creek drainage is a little dismaying. It makes me wonder where he got the idea it was up Frank Creek to begin with.

-- Tim.M

[Kim_S]

Mike, thanks again for posting some of your knowledge about August Jacob's.

[Grecy]

I too have bashed up Frank Creek with no success.
I followed painted trees and flag tape for a long time, only to find it was marking the edge of a logging block.

A long time ago I found http://www.clubtread.com/sforum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=6649&SearchTerms=august,jacob this thread on club tread where foxtrot confirms there is without a doubt AT LEAST one spring in there we do not know about, probably even two.
hmmmmm.
Anyone have any good leads?

-Dan

[Tim_Messing]

just thought I'd distill and repost the comments from that Club Tread link related to August Jacob's Hot Springs.

Posted - 07/01/2004 : 06:40 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You know there is a rumored 4th set of hotsprings along this road. The third one is a secret place that I'm sworn to secrecy on, but on the harrsison lake side of the Sckoocumchuck village, (that old church I told you about) there are several rivers. Ask the locals about which river leads you up into the mountains, and to some very spectacular springs. I've tried to find them several times, but never have.

Posted - 07/03/2004 : 10:22 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Secrecy, huh? Sounds like a challenge, I want to find them even more-so now
Hehehehe I sure love the Internet! Is it called "August Jacob's"?
The MapPlace shows a spring VERY close to sloquet but definately different... and not near Skookum...

Posted - 07/03/2004 : 10:54 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
How many have you been to.. ?

Pebble Creek Hotsprings (Keyhole Falls) - NW of Pemberton (Source: Backroad Mapbook, not on MapPlace)
Meager Creek Hotsprings - NW of Pemberton (Source: The MapPlace - identified as NO GOOD)
"ELAHO RIVER" - Garibaldi Park - along Helm Creek Trail (Source: The MapPlace)
"SHOVELNOSE" - NW of Squamish, along "Turbid Creek", near Cheakamus Divide
"TURBID CREEK" - NW of Squamish, along "Turbid Creek", near Cheakamus Divide
Pitt River Hotsprings - see the post made in the forums a little while ago..(how do the logging trucks get there if there are no roads to it??)
SLOQUET
AUGUST JACOB'S
SKOOKUMCHUCK
CLEAR CREEK
HARRISON
CEDAR HOT SPRINGS - east of Kelowna
WILLIAMS LAKE - near 141 mile house
BRIGHAM - north of Lillooet
CLEARWATER - NE of 100 mile house
The mystery spring that the Skookumchuck natives know of?

Posted - 07/04/2004 : 06:43 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Wow that an impresive list Shadow Chaser. I wish I had map source while I was living out in BC.

I hate to bust your buble though, but the third (secret)hotsprings I'm talkikng about, between lets say Scoocumchuck and say Sloquet are not on your list. I don't think, and or hope they never find their way onto mapsource either.

The forth ones are about half way between Scoocumchuck and Sloquet, before you hit the Harison Main logging road. One of the many bridges you cross has the name of the creek/river written on it. You're supposed to follow this creek up to the said 4th springs.

I've seen August Jacob's from the road side of the river. It apears you need to cross the river by foot to get to them. I've heard they are worth the extra effort. Shadow Chaser have you been to August Jacobs?

Posted - 07/04/2004 : 12:48 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
No, I've never been to Sloquet, unfortinately. I've done the Harrison to Pemberton trip, but unfortinately we never stopped at Sloquet (person I was with didn't want to go!)

Judging by MapPlace, "August Jacob's" is ~ halfway between Sloquet and Skookum (by road, anyways). Is that the 4th set you mentioned, or is there a 5th set?

MapSource was created by the mining resources people in the government - it has a lot of geothermal data as a result. That entire area is flagged with extreme geothermal potential - there are probably even more springs that we don't realize. I wish I had the time just to go up there and explore..

It's too bad they built the road to Clear Creek - all the rednecks go up there now since they don't need to carry their beer to the springs!

Has anyone been to Kalyama?

-- Tim.M

[Tim_Messing]

Judging by that MapPlace submission there might be something going on up Fire Creek. I'll have to look into getting my hands on some maps of the area.

The third unkown\unnamed (August Jacob's?) hot springs that Foxtrots was talking about must be along the Lillooet River someplace within view of the East Lillooet Forest Road. Seems like this one would have been found by the kayaking\rafting crowd by now. I wonder if this isn't the one that Bulldozer's native guide wasn't referring to...

Claimed it was down by/above Port Douglas, opposite side of the valley to Sloquet H/s.

The fourth one Foxtrots discribed seems to be the erronous location of August Jacob's on Frank Creek from Woodsworth's book.

-- Tim.M

[trevor_n_jane]

Any update on the publishing of Glenn Woodsworth Hot Springs of Western Canada 3rd Edition? I'm game for bushwacking indefinitely, my kids might, but my husband (the senior member of our troupe) gets a little anxious about 4 hours in.

[BNMac]

... I'm game for bushwacking indefinitely, my kids might, but my husband (the senior member of our troupe) gets a little anxious about 4 hours in.

LOL!!! Giggle.... Yea, sounds kind of like our clan - tho it's my wife that used to be a little skittish about cross country bushwacking. She getting frail enough these days that she sticks to the easy strolls.

--Bruce...

[Ashbless]

Any update on the publishing of Glenn Woodsworth Hot Springs of Western Canada 3rd Edition? I'm game for bushwacking indefinitely, my kids might, but my husband (the senior member of our troupe) gets a little anxious about 4 hours in.

Hi all: I'm new here. But I've heard that it's supposed to be out next spring and should have directions to A. Jacob's. We'll see.
William

[Grecy]

well if they are already going to be published, he may as well just tell us now

I'll be at Meager and Pebble/Keyhole around the 7th-14th August if anyone wants to meet up and have another go at finding A. Jacob's (although I don't have any new information)

-Dan

[Mike_Sato]

>Tim M

I met with Glenn Woodsworth in Vancouver on July 30. He will be releasing a 3rd edition of his book soon, as it has been 10 years since his last edition. It will be published next March. Regarding the August Jacobs, I gave him the directions and he finally tracked it down May of last year.

When finding hidden hot springs, it is important to know that the source for the Backroad Mapbook/MapPlace, etc – all get there information from the same government geothermal data. But I have already discovered that there are many inaccuracies in this data, and it is not ideal for searching for hidden hot springs.

I have visited all the hot springs that Shadowchaser listed, but there are a many errors in that list.

1)"ELAHO RIVER" - Garibaldi Park - along Helm Creek Trail (Source: The MapPlace)

It can not be found in Garibaldi Park, it is located in Upper Squamish Valley. It is also a cold spring.

2)"SHOVELNOSE" - NW of Squamish, along "Turbid Creek", near Cheakamus Divide

It is not along Turbid Creek, it is by Shovelnose Creek. It is a warm spring but does not have enough flow.

3)"TURBID CREEK" - NW of Squamish, along "Turbid Creek", near Cheakamus Divide

This also a warm spring with not enough flow. Can be found near the bottom of Mt. Cayley.

4)CEDAR HOT SPRINGS - east of Kelowna

This is just a Hot Tub. It has nothing to do with hot springs or mineral springs. It no longer exists. I have mentioned this many times in the past.

5)WILLIAMS LAKE - near 141 mile house

This is a cold mineral springs. Tastes of iron, and has large tufa deposits. Generally known as Johnson Springs.

6)BRIGHAM - north of Lillooet

North of Lillooet is too far, it is located at the south of William Lake. It is a soda spring with very little flow. Nearby, you can find the Riske Creek Springs, which is much better with more flow.

7)CLEARWATER - NE of 100 mile house

This is a cold soda spring.

8)The mystery spring that the Skookumchuck natives know of?

This spring does not exist. I was part of the research team that was hired by In-SHUCK-ch Nation to find such mystery spring (because they had no information regarding it), but even we could not find it. Unless you are referring to the August Jacobs and Glacier Lake, which are already well known, only though few have visited.

If anybody ever wants to talk about BC hot springs in person, I am in Squamish so just let me know whenever you are passing by.


Mike Sato